Ben Stein on the Death of the Necktie: Your Office's Style

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  S.Howard-Sarin07/30/08 Report as spam
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  You haven't looked in my bottom drawer, Michael

  That sounded unintentionally dirty... what I meant is that if you need a shot of something stronger than Diet Coke, I can hook you up.

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  sbrennaman35407/31/08 Report as spam
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  RE: Ben Stein on the Death of the Necktie: Your Office's Style

  This is another subject that, in reality, should not need discussing. But here goes. The original purpose of a ?tie? was for members of the royal court to protect their ?finery? from being soiled when eating or lounging around the table. Through the years the tie became a symbol of refinement and class (not class in the sense of society but of style).
  
  As the centuries passed the affectation of the tie has evolved into what we see today. And even among the tie wearers of our society (I am one ?I enjoy a good suit and tie at work) there is discussion (argument) on whether it is important to wear suits/ties/etc.
  
  My thoughts and beliefs are a result of my parent's actions and attitudes; my having done blue collar work and serving in the military, as well as my desire to be viewed by others as refined and mannered. Wearing a suit or sports coat with a tie is not a burden rather it is an expression of who I am without having to worry about the presentation. The old adage of wearing the clothes for the job you aspire to (1 or 2 levels up) does not always work but you get the point. Finally, after 35 years in leadership and management roles I find people act and perform better when dressed more formally than Dockers and a golf shirt. If you spill coffee or drop crumbs on your clothing then maybe you need a bib or maybe the tie will serve its real purpose.

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  sbrennaman35407/31/08 Report as spam
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  RE: Ben Stein on the Death of the Necktie: Your Office's Style

  I should have wtched the video first. Now I know I am right. Go Ben!!!

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  pesc07/31/08 Report as spam
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  RE: Ben Stein on the Death of the Necktie: Your Office's Style

  I agree that one acts and feels more professional in a tie than sans.
  
  If you want to be taken slightly more seriously, don't go open necked.
  
  To close a deal, i always wear a tailored suit -- if the client can afford to spend millions on my firm and it's products and services, i can afford to dress up for the occassion.

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  mabloom7707/31/08 Report as spam
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  RE: Ben Stein on the Death of the Necktie: Your Office's Style

  How we dress is purely a cultural thing.
  
  Dressing for the culture you in is what is important.
  
  I know of (and could not find any) research that shows people who dress for higher status in their culture peform their work better.
  
  The impact is mostly about how other's feel about you based on what you were in THEIR culture.
  
  When working in Argentina, I had trouble being taken seriously as a "dot net techo weanie" because I had on business casual clothes. It was amazing how much better I work with others in that culture when I wore black suites and white shirts.
  
  Another part of this equation has to do with the kind of work you do. No one expects the dish washer to wear a tie. However, the waiter wearing a tie makes you feel more important.
  
  My point is that the costume you wear should be appropriate to the audience. There is no "absolute correct" way to dress. Only personal relationships to be thought of.

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  kajira207/31/08 Report as spam
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  RE: Ben Stein on the Death of the Necktie: Your Office's Style

  Interesting. Over here in Japan the government is pursuing their "Cool Biz" program again this summer -- no neckties, open shirts.
  
  Cut to a televised heated debate in the Japanese Diet over the current state of the country (shipwreck) -- the opposition DPJ are dressed smartly in suits and ties, the current government (LDP) in open shits (Prime Minister Fukuda excepted). While the DPJ look like they're ready for business, the LDP look like a bunch of yakuza swells lounging around poolside.
  
  Neither party has a solution to the country's problems, but surely in a time of crisis leadership is called upon to project a suitable image.

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  pcarlin/New York City08/05/08 Report as spam
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  RE: Ben Stein on the Death of the Necktie: Your Office's Style

  So I guess no one will take a woman in the office seriously because she doesn???t wear a necktie. That???s complete nonsense. One???s clothes have absolutely no bearing on one???s level of professionalism. It???s all in your head. It appears to be a form of mental illness. But of course, if everyone does it, it can not be crazy behavior.
  
  Of course, the monkey do, monkey see rule applies in most offices. To join the club, one must act and dress like everyone else. The first person to stand up appear/look or act different is immediately ejected. Conformity is the American way.
  
  Hopefully, corporations will some day respect and appreciate people for their contributions, and not for the way they dress.
  
  It wasn???t long ago when men thought that woman couldn???t make a contribution outside the home. Maybe, some day soon, people will feel the same way about the necktieless worker.

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  rapino08/12/08 Report as spam
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  RE: Ben Stein on the Death of the Necktie: Your Office's Style

  It is not complete non-sense that presentation style affects how people are perceived. To claim otherwise is to deny we are human, though some folks would like to think that
  
  What would you think if one of the presentation candidates were to show business casual to a national TV debate?
  
  The options on the survey seem to miss the middle ground of non-formal business attire: khakis and a polo shirt, something between your definition of "Biz Casual" and "Hipster Biz Casual" which is the preponderance in the companies I have worked at.

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  pesc09/26/08 Report as spam
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  RE: Ben Stein on the Death of the Necktie: Your Office's Style

  wow. going from the tie as iconic of formal dress to misogyny. Interesting.

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  IMLaughlin09/30/08 Report as spam
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  RE: Ben Stein on the Death of the Necktie: Your Office's Style

  When "pay grades" above me stop dressing professionally then I might consider it. Dress for the respect of the people you need to influence to get the job done.
  
  Tip: If you want courtesy and attention at your next visit to a friend or relative in the hospital, arrive with a tie and dress shirt, sleeves rolled-up. Since hospital staff can't take the chance you're not a physician, you'll be impressed by the attention, smiles and friendly greetings. Next visit, arrive in jeans or a warm-up suit like most family members. Observe the difference in how staff treats you. Take lesson, apply to office.